[Call to Order, Pledges, and Invocation] [00:00:09] ALL RIGHT, IT IS AS:00 P.M., TUESDAY, MAY 28. I CALL THIS MEETING TO ORDER. I WILL LEAD, SO IF WOULD BOW WITH ME WE PRAY. BOTHER ME, FOR YOU THIS EVENING AND WE THANK YOU ABUNDANT BLESSINGS IN OUR COMMUNITY. WE PRAY THAT YOU WOULD JUST CONTINUE -- EVIDENT AND RETHINK YOU FOR WHO YOU ARE AND ALL THAT YOU ARE IN THIS AND THROUGH US, AND VISIT DECISIONS THAT WE MAKE THIS EVENING WOULD BE REFLECTIVE OF YOUR WILL FOR A COMMUNITY. LORD WE PRAY THAT HE WOULD BLESS ALL OF OUR FIRST RESPONDERS WHO ARE SERVING OUR COMMUNITY FOR YOU THIS EVENING , AND THIS EVENING WOULD BE A GOOD DAY AND A GOOD EVENING FOR THOSE MEN AND WOMEN WHO SERVE US SO DILIGENTLY. LORD, WE GIVE THIS TIME TO YOU THAT YOUR BLESSING AND HAND BE UPON IT. IN JESUS NAME, AMEN. >> I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION, UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. >> HONOR THE TEXAS FLAG. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THEE, TEXAS, ONE STATE UNDER GOD, ONE AND INDIVISIBLE. >> THE FIRST ITEM ON TONIGHT'S [2024-177] AGENDA , WHICH WOULD BE 2024- 177, THE CEREMONIAL OATH OF OFFICE FOR THE NEWLY ELECTED COUNCIL MEMBER, ROSS WEAVER. JUDGE TRAILER IS HERE TO SWEAR ROSS WEAVER IN. WE ASK FOR ROSS AND HEATHER TO COME FORWARD, AND ANY FAMILY MEMBERS THAT WOULD LIKE TO PARTICIPATE. >> >> WE WELCOME ROSS WEAVER TO THE TEAM. GLAD TO WORK WITH YOU , AND CONGRATULATIONS TO THE ENTIRE WEAVER FAMILY. WE APPRECIATE YOUR SACRIFICES FOR ALLOWING US TO STEAL ROSS FROM [2024-178] YOU, IT IS EQUITIES AND KNOWLEDGEBASE. THANK YOU, JUDGE TRAILER PICK THE NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA THIS EDOM IS 2024-178, AND THAT IS TO ELECT A MAYOR PRO TEM. CURRENTLY THE MAYOR PRO TEM HAS SERVED ON THE CAPACITY OVER THE PAST YEAR. HE HAS DONE EVERYTHING I HAVE ASKED HIM TO DO, BEEN AVAILABLE TO THE COMMUNITY , AND AN ADVOCATE TO THE COMMUNITY THROUGH THAT ROLE. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON A MAYOR PRO TEM FOR THIS NEXT YEAR? HEARING NO DISCUSSION, I WILL MAKE A MOTION TO REAPPOINT CLARK WICKLIFFE AS THE MAYOR PRO TEM. MOTION BY MYSELF, SECOND BY MR. RODGERS. PLEASE VOTE . THAT ITEM PASSES 4-1. OPENING ITEM 2024-179 , CITY COUNCIL REPORT ON ITEMS OF COMMUNITY INTEREST. THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO SHARE COMMUNITY EVENTS ARE THINGS THAT WE HAVE ATTENDED , OR STAFF MEMBERS THAT HAVE GONE ABOVE AND BEYOND THE CALL OF DUTY. DOES ANYBODY WANT TO PRESENT AN ITEM OF COMMUNITY INTEREST? HEARING NONE, WE WILL MOVE ONTO THE NEXT ITEM. A [2024-180] QUIET CROWD THIS EVENING. ITEM 2024-180 , CITIZENS TO BE HEARD. THE CITY COUNCIL INVITES CITIZENS TO ADDRESS THE CANCEL ON ANY TOPIC NOT ONLY SCHEDULED FOR PUBLIC HEARING. DISTANCE WISHING TO SPEAK TO COMPLETE AS IT IS IN PROCESS DELETION FORM AND SUBMITTED TO THE CITY SECRETARY. IT'S LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES. IS THERE ANYONE WHO WANTS TO SPEAK? >> GRAY BUTTON AND ONCE THE MICROPHONE IS ON YOU WILL HAVE [00:05:01] THREE MINUTES. >> NESTLED BETWEEN KIRK AND DAISY STREET. THE COMMUNITY DEEPLY INVESTS IN THE FABRIC OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. TONIGHT WE COME TOGETHER TO PURCHASE A -- PETITION FOR A REEVALUATION -- OUR PROPOSAL IS FOR A TRANSITION TO RESIDENTIAL-COMME RCIAL ZONING. THE CHANGE WE WILL BELIEVE WILL SERVE AS A CATALYST FOR GROWTH AND REVITALIZATION. THE PURPOSE, REZONING IS NOT MERELY A CHANGE ON PAPER, A VISION FOR AN ENVIRONMENT OF THE FUTURE. PROMISES TO BLEND RESIDENTIAL LIFE WITH THE DYNAMIC ENERGY OF COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT. THIS FUSION CAN CREATE A SYNERGY THAT BENEFITS NOT ONLY HER NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT ALSO THE BROADER COMMUNITY BY PROVIDING JOBS, SUPPORTING ENTREPRENEURSHIP, AND ENHANCING THE OVERALL QUALITY OF LIFE. WE UNDERSTAND THIS CHANGE CAN BE DAUNTING, AND WE APPROACH THIS REQUEST WITH THE UTMOST RESPECT FOR THE COMMITTEE'S EXPERTISE IN THE PROCESSES THAT SAFEGUARD OUR TOWN'S DEVELOPMENT. WE ARE COMMITTED TO AN OPEN DIALOGUE , AND ARE PREPARED TO WORK COLLABORATIVELY TO ADDRESS ANY CONCERNS OR QUESTIONS THAT MAY ARISE. WE ASK THE COMMUNITY TO CONSIDER THE POTENTIAL THAT RESIDENTIAL COMMERCIAL ZONE HOLDS FOR OUR COMMUNITY. IT IS AN OPPORTUNITY TO LAY THE GROUNDWORK FOR A THRIVING AREA THAT ECHOES THE EVOLVING NEEDS AND ASPIRATIONS OF ITS RESIDENTS. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND CONSIDERATION. >> WOULD YOU SAY THE AREA AGAIN ? >> >> THANK YOU, SIR. ALL RIGHT. ANY OTHER SPEAKERS? OKAY. [CONSENT AGENDA] MOVING ON TO THE CONSENT AGENDA. ALL MATTERS LISTED ON THE CONSENT AGENDA ARE CONSIDERED TO BE RETAINED BY THE CITY COUNCIL AND WILL BE ENACTED BY ONE MOTION WITHOUT SEPARATE DISCUSSION. IF DISCUSSION IS DESIRED, THAT AGENDA ITEM WILL BE REMOVED FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA AND WILL BE CONSIDERED SEPARATELY. DOES ANYONE WANT TO REMOVE ITEMS FROM THIS CONSENT AGENDA? HEARING NONE, I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THIS CONSENT AGENDA. MOTION TO APPROVE BY MAYOR PRO [2024-183] TEM, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER RODGERS. PLEASE VOTE. ITEM PASSES 5-0. TO THE PUBLIC HEARINGS, 2024-183, CONDUCT A PUBLIC HEARING AND CONSIDER AND ACT UPON A RESOLUTION ADOPTING THE 2024 CITY OF MIDLOTHIAN TAX ABATEMENT POLICY ESTABLISHING GUIDELINES AND MATERIAL FOR A TAX ABATEMENT PROGRAM. KYLE, WELCOME. >> GOOD EVENING. THANK YOU FOR HAVING THIS ITEM. I COME HERE BEFORE YOU TO RENEW THE EXISTING POLICY . I HAVE INCLUDED INFORMATION IF IT IS HELPFUL FOR THE COUNCIL TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ON. THE CURRENT TAX ABATEMENT POLICY IN PLACE IS THAT THERE ARE NO CHANGES AS WE MOVE INTO THE PROPOSED POLICY THAT WILL BE IN PLACE FOR THE NEXT TWO YEARS. IF IT IS ALSO HELPFUL TO PROVIDE MORE OF AN OVERVIEW OF TAX ABATEMENT, I WILL BE HAPPY TO PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION AS WELL IF SO DIRECTED. >> THIS NEEDS TO BE RENEWED AND REVIEWED ONCE EVERY TWO YEARS? >> CORRECT. >> HEARING NO ONE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK, I WILL TAKE A MOTION TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. MOTION TO CLOSE BY COUNCIL MEMBER RODGERS , SECONDED BY MAYOR PRO TEM. PLEASE VOTE TO CLOSE A PUBLIC HEARING. ITEM PASSES 5-0. ANY QUESTIONS FOR KYLE OR STAFF? >> I, SO ON THE TAX ABATEMENT PROGRAM -- PROJECTS THAT ARE $50 MILLION OR LARGER? >> CORRECT. IN THE TAX ABATEMENT PROGRAM -- PROVIDE A LITTLE BIT OF AN OVERVIEW FOR THAT SPECIFIC QUESTION. >> >> PERFECT. SO, OUR SPECIFIC TAX ABATEMENT POLICY AND PROGRAM THAT WE HAVE , CITIES HAVE THE ABILITY, CITIES AND COUNTIES HAVE THE ABILITY TO CREATE TAX ABATEMENT POLICIES AND PROGRAMS THAT ARE SPECIFIC TO THEIR COMMUNITY. WITHIN OUR CURRENT POLICY THAT WE HAVE, WE USE THE TAX ABATEMENT INCENTIVE REALLY AS THE CADILLAC PROGRAM , FOR THE LARGEST PROJECTS THAT WE HAVE IN OUR COMMUNITY ARE THE MOST TARGETED TO THOSE THAT PRODUCE INTEREST TO THE RESIDENCE , AS WE WILL TALK ABOUT. OTHERWISE WE HAVE OTHER TOOLS THAT WE ARE ABLE TO USE WHICH ALLOW THE CITY TO HAVE MORE FUNDS IN THE GENERAL FUND. SO THE THREE THINGS THAT THIS POLICY IS APPLICABLE TO PROJECTS ARE ONE, THE FIRST ONE IS THOSE PROJECTS THAT HAVE [00:10:08] AVERAGE WAGES THAT EXCEED NOT ONLY THE COUNTY AVERAGE BUT THE COUNTY AVERAGE FOR THAT SPECIFIC INDUSTRY. FOR EXAMPLE, THE COUNTY AVERAGE WAGES 55,000, BUT IF WE ARE LOOKING AT MANUFACTURING PROJECTS, WE WENT THOSE THAT ARE ROUGHLY AROUND $76,000, RIGHT? IT IS ABOVE AND BEYOND WAGES SO THAT THEY REALLY ARE PROVIDING THAT HIGHEST AND BEST IMPACT INTO OUR COMMUNITY. THE SECOND ONE THAT WE HAVE IS PROJECTS THAT EXCEED $50 MILLION IN TAXABLE VALUE. IN ORDER TO QUALIFY , THEY COULD QUALIFY BY HAVING SIGNIFICANT TAX VALUE. TO GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE, OF THE 20 TOP PAYING TAXPAYERS IN THE CITY , ONLY SEVEN ARE OVER 50 MILLION . IT REALLY IS ONLY THOSE PROJECTS THAT REALLY HAVE THE MOST TAXABLE VALUE AND ARE ASSOCIATED WITH LOWER COST OF SERVICE. THE THIRD THING THAT TAX ABATEMENT CAN BE APPLIED TO OUR PROJECTS THAT ARE WITHIN THE DOWNTOWN AREA . THAT IS ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY. SO, THOSE ARE THE THREE THINGS WHERE WE AS A COMMUNITY HAVE KIND OF NARROWED THAT SCOPE. OTHERWISE WE FOLLOW ALL OF THE STATE REQUIREMENTS ASSOCIATED WITH THE POLICY. >> COUNSEL, FURTHER QUESTIONS? HEARING NONE , I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. >> I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE. >> MOTION TO APPROVE BY MAYOR PRO TEM. >> I WILL SECOND IT. >> PLEASE VOTE. THE ITEM PASSES [2024-184] 5-0. THANK YOU. ONTO THE REGULAR AGENDA. ITEM NUMBER 2024-184, CONSIDER AND ACT UPON AN ORDINANCE AMENDING CHAPTER 11 TITLE TAXATION OF THE CODE OF ORDINANCES BY ADDING A NEW SECTION 11.02.035 TO DIVISION II TITLED EXEMPTIONS RELATING TO PROVIDING FOR A TAX EXEMPTION FOR THE YEAR 2024 AND EACH YEAR THEREAFTER ON QUALIFYING CHILD CARE FACILITIES, PROVIDING A REPEALING CAUSE, PROVIDING A SEVERABILITY WAS , PROVIDING A SAVINGS CLAUSE, AND PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE. >> SO THIS ITEM WAS BROUGHT FORWARD AS A RESULT OF A CALL FROM ONE OF THE PROPERTY OWNERS WHERE A CHILD CARE CENTER IS LOCATED HERE IN THE CITY. THIS IS A BRAND-NEW LAW , OR A VERY RECENT LAW. AND SO , THERE ARE SEVERAL REQUIREMENTS FOR AN ENTITY OR A PROPERTY OWNER TO BE ABLE TO APPLY FOR THIS EXEMPTION. I THINK THE INTENT WAS THAT IT WOULD LOWER THE TAX BURDEN ON THE PROPERTY OWNER, OR THE LESSOR , WHO COULD THEN PASS THOSE SAVINGS ONTO THE CHILDCARE CENTER , AND THEN ULTIMATELY THEY COULD PASS THOSE SAVINGS ONTO THE CHILDREN THAT WERE RECEIVING ASSISTANCE FROM THE STATE. THESE REQUIREMENTS AT THE OWNER, THE OPERATOR HAS TO PARTICIPATE IN THE TEXAS WORKFORCE COMMISSION, TEXAS RISING STAR PROGRAM , AND AT LEAST 20% OF THE CHILDREN ENROLLED IN THE FACILITY HAVE SUBSIDIZED CHILDCARE . IF IT IS BEING LEASED TO A CHILD CARE OPERATOR, THE OWNER HAS TO PROVIDE A DISCLOSURE DOCUMENT, LETTING THEM KNOW WHAT THE AMOUNT OF THE EXCEPTION IS, AND POSSIBLY PASSED ON AS A REDUCTION TO THEIR RENT. THAT IS KIND OF THE IDEA BEHIND THIS. THERE ARE FIVE CHILDCARE FACILITIES IN THE CITY THAT QUALIFY AND ARE REGISTERED WITH THIS TEXAS RISING STAR PROGRAM. THE AMENDMENT THAT I HAVE DOWN HERE, AND IT SAYS VERY CAREFULLY FROM MY PERSPECTIVE , USING AVAILABLE APPRAISED VALUES, THE ESTIMATE IS 16 479. I WANT TO BE REALLY TRANSPARENT THAT I COULD ONLY GET VALUES FOR 3 OF THE FIVE , AND ONE OF THOSE IS LOCATED IN A CHURCH , SO I BELIEVE IT IS CONSIDERED TAX EXEMPT AS FAR AS THE COUNTY IS CONCERNED THE APPRAISAL DISTRICT, AND THE OTHER ONE MAY BE NEW ENOUGH THAT ITS VALUE IS NOT THERE YET EITHER. MY ESTIMATE IS THAT MIGHT BE 2 TO 3 TIMES WHAT WE WOULD BE GIVING UP IN REVENUE. AGAIN THAT IS NOT JUST A WHOLE LOT, BUT IT IS SOMETHING YOU TO CONSIDER. IT COULD BE AS MUCH AS 100% EXEMPTION. IT COULD BE AS LOW AS 50, BUT IT HAS TO BE 50 TO 100. I HAVE WRITTEN THE ORDINANCE AT 100%, BECAUSE OTHER CITIES IN THE COUNTY HAVE USED THAT. HOWEVER, YOU COULD CHOOSE, IF YOU DECIDE TO APPROVE THIS, ANYTHING FROM 50 TO 100. I WILL BE GLAD TO [00:15:08] ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS. >> THANK YOU. ANYONE TO SPEAK ON THIS? COUNCIL QUESTIONS? I HAVE ONE, AND THAT IS THE APPROVAL OF THIS ORDINANCE RINGS IS IN LINE WITH THE NEW STATE LAW I GUESS? >> WELL, IT IS A NEW OPPORTUNITY FOR AN EXEMPTION AMOUNT BUT IT IS NOT A REQUIREMENT, NO. IT IS DEFINITELY OPTIONAL, AND I WANT TO MAKE THAT VERY CLEAR TO EVERYBODY. >> I THINK I HEARD YOU CORRECTLY BUT I WANT TO DOUBLE CHECK, BECAUSE THE PACKET SAYS THE LOW-IMPACT AT 100%, 16,000? >> BASED ON THE AVAILABLE INFORMATION, BUT IT WAS ONLY THOSE THREE THAT I WAS ABLE TO DETERMINE, BECAUSE WHEN I BELIEVE MAY BE COMPLETELY TAX-EXEMPT BECAUSE IT IS LOCATED INSIDE OF A CHURCH , AND THE OTHER WHEN THERE WAS NO APPRAISAL VALUE. SO I CAN'T GIVE YOU A GOOD ESTIMATE OF WHAT IT WILL BE . MY THOUGHT IS IT WILL PROBABLY BE 2 TO 3 TIMES THAT WOULD BE THE AMOUNT OF REVENUE THAT WOULD BE LOST EVERY YEAR, BUT AGAIN THAT'S NOT A HUGE NUMBER, BUT IT IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD COME OFF OF THE TAX. THE REVENUE COMING IN. >> CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, WHILE SOME OF THESE FACILITIES ARE REGISTERED IN THE TEXAS RISING STAR, WE ARE NOT SURE IF 20% OF THE CHILDREN ARE THERE, SO THEY MAY NOT BE ELIGIBLE AT ALL, EVEN IF THEY ARE IN PART OF THE PROGRAM. THEY DON'T HAVE 20% OF THE CHILDREN THERE, THAT HAVE BEEN A COUPLE OF THE CALLS THAT WE HAVE GOTTEN INTO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. THEY MIGHT BE PART OF THE PROGRAM, BUT THEY DON'T MEET THE 20% CRITERIA. >> AND I WILL ALSO ADD TO THIS POINT , AS I WAS WRITING THIS, NO ONE HAD CONTACTED THE APPRAISAL DISTRICT FOR THIS YET . IT WAS, I THINK, AGAIN, SOMEONE WHO HAD A DAYCARE FACILITY, THEY WERE BRINGING TO THAT COLIN ASKED ABOUT IT, AND WE DO OTHER CITIES IN THE COUNTY WHO HAVE ADOPTED THIS AT 100%. IT WAS BROUGHT UP MORE FOR DISCUSSION AND CONSIDERATION. ASSUMING YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO TONIGHT. YOU CAN DECIDE TO DO IT LATER, OR JUST, YOU KNOW, IT IS UP TO YOU ALL. >> YOU MENTIONED EARLIER THAT SOME OF THESE PLACES ARE LOCATED IN CHURCHES WHICH WOULD BE A NONPROFIT ORGANIZATION. NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS ARE ALREADY TAX-EXEMPT. >> NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS ARE ALREADY TAX-EXEMPT. I DID NOT GET THE VALUE FOR THAT PARTICULAR ONE. >> I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT FOR US TO LOOK AT THE FACT THAT THIS TAX INCENTIVE WOULD ONLY BE APPLIED TO FOR-PROFIT ENTERPRISES MANATT NOT-FOR-PROFIT ENTERPRISES. IF WE ARE WEIGHING THAT CONSIDERATION. THERE IS ONLY A MECHANISM IN PLACE UNDER STATE LAW IN THE TAX CODE THAT COVERS NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS WHO ARE PROVIDING SERVICES. DO YOU MIND SHARING WHICH OF OUR OTHER ELLIS COUNTY CITIES YOU LOOKED INTO? >> LOXAHATCHEE DID APPROVE THIS I BELIEVE , AND THEY DID IT 100%. >> COUNSEL MY QUESTIONS , AND/OR MOTION, OR WE CAN TABLE TO DISCUSS FURTHER LATER . ANY ACTION WILL DO. >> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE, AND WE HAVE TO GIVE A PERCENT? >> 100%. IF YOU JUST WANTED TO APPROVE THIS PERCENTAGE, THEN YOU WOULD NOT HAVE TO GIVE A PERCENTAGE. >> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS PRESENTED. >> HAVE A MOTION FROM COUNCILMEMBER HARTSON. WE HAVE A SECOND ON THAT? I WILL SECOND THAT. >> VOTE, I DO, I MEAN -- THIS IS A FOR-PROFIT BUSINESS, AND THAT NOW GRANTED IT IS FOR CHILDCARE SERVICES, BUT IF IT IS FOR HEALTHCARE SERVICES, YOU ARE SAVING LIVES, RIGHT? BUT THEY ARE A FOR-PROFIT ENTERPRISE. IF IT IS ANY OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT IMPACT EMPLOYEE LIFE FOR A COMMUNITY, BUT THEY ARE FOR PROFIT ENTERPRISES, WE ARE ESSENTIALLY NOW SAYING THAT HE WERE A FOR PROFIT COMPANY RECEIVING THE BENEFIT OF A NONPROFIT ORGANIZATION , AND I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT, BECAUSE IF WE ARE GOING TO DO THAT, THEN THERE ARE MANY OTHER BUSINESSES THAT QUALIFY FOR THIS. >> BUT THIS IS ONLY SPECIFICALLY FOR -- >> THERE HAS BEEN A LONG-STANDING TRADITION IN OUR STATE WITH FOR PROFIT ENTERPRISES , THEY PAY TAXES WHEN THEY MAKE PROFITS. NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS DON'T, BECAUSE I DON'T MAKE PROFITS. I THINK WE HAVE TO KEEP THAT CLEARLY IN MIND -- ] -- THIS IS SUBSIDIZING A FOR PROFIT ENTERPRISE. [00:20:06] >> UNDERSTOOD. THERE IS A MOTION AND A SECOND. FURTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS MOTION? PLEASE VOTE. THE ITEM FAILS 3-2. PRESENTING AN ALTERNATE MOTION? HEARING NONE -- >> >> THE ONLY THING I'M NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND IS HOW MANY ENTITIES THIS DECISION WILL AFFECT. >> WELL, SHOULD THEY APPLY , IT WOULD ONLY AFFECT FOUR. THERE ARE FIVE THAT WOULD POSSIBLY QUALIFY, BECAUSE THEY ARE REGISTERED WITH THIS RISING STAR PROGRAM THROUGH THE TEXAS WORKFORCE COMMISSION. ONE OF THE FIVE TOTAL THAT ARE REGISTERED WITH THEM IS NOT PROFIT . SO IT WOULDN'T APPLY TO THEM AT THIS POINT FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND. >> CITY , SO THIS IS A BRAND-NEW LAW -- >> IT IS A NEW LAW, AND A TECHNICALLY TO ACTUALLY -- AND RIGHT NOW, I DON'T BELIEVE ANYBODY HAS APPLIED, SO IT WON'T AFFECT ANYBODY TODAY . THE LAW SAYS , OR THE TEXAS WORKFORCE COMMISSION -- THEY HAD TO DO THEIR APPLICATION BY AUGUST 30, SORRY. OUR COUNTY EXTENDED THAT TO ME 15, AND THAT ALLOWED THE ACTUAL ONE, I BELIEVE THE CHILDCARE FACILITY IN LOXAHATCHEE TO BE ABLE TO APPLY AND GET THAT. SO, I THINK A LOT OF CHILDCARE FACILITIES SAW THIS AND THOUGHT THEY WERE GOING TO BE ABLE TO GET IT, AND THEY ARE NOT. SO THIS IS JUST AN OPPORTUNITY, IF THEY QUALIFY , AND THEY HAVE A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE OF CHILDREN THAT ARE SUBSIDIZED BY THE STATE, YOU KNOW, THEY MAY BE LOWER INCOME OR WHATEVER ISSUES. THAT IS WHAT IT IS FOR. IN THEORY, WE ALL KNOW HOW THINGS GO SOMETIMES WHEN IT IS IN THEORY, BUT IT IS SUPPOSED TO HELP THOSE THAT THE MONEY EVENTUALLY TRICKLES DOWN TO THE FAMILIES THAT ARE PAYING FOR CHILD CARE. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT HELPED OR HURT. >> MILLION OUT OF OUR REVENUE STREAM LAST YEAR , AND I'M GETTING A LITTLE NERVOUS HERE -- WE AS CONSERVATIVES DO KNEE-JERK REACTIONS AT TIMES -- GOTTEN RID OF, WHICH IS 23% OF OUR INCOME REVENUES -- INAUDIBLE ] >> I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO THINK ABOUT THIS TODAY. >> MY ONLY COMMENT WAS IF IT IS THE WILL OF THE COUNCIL TONIGHT TO POSSIBLY TABLE THIS, BECAUSE LAST TIME WE WERE PASSING ON THESE EXEMPTIONS BEFORE BUDGET. I WOULD LIKE TO GO THROUGH BUDGET AND THEN TALK ABOUT EXEMPTIONS, BECAUSE I KIND OF GOT US IN A WEIRD DECISION LAST TIME. YEAH, I GUESS -- >> DEFINITELY. >> YEAH, BECAUSE AT THIS POINT, NOBODY HAS APPLIED FOR IT, AND UNLESS THE APPRAISAL DISTRICT EXTENDS IT AGAIN , YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK THAT THERE IS ANYBODY GOING TO GET IT THIS YEAR ANYWAY, SO WE CAN LOOK AT IT AFTER BUDGET AND TALK ABOUT IT FOR NEXT YEAR. >> WE CAN JUST LEAVE IT AND WE CAN GET BACK -- >> YEAH. WE CAN BRING IT BACK AT A LATER DATE. I'M SAYING -- >> IT DOES NOT REQUIRE ANY ACTION SINCE THE MOTION TO [2024-185] APPROVE AS PRESENTED FAILED. WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ITEM. OPENING ITEM 2024-185, REVIEW AND DISCUSS THE DEVELOPMENT OF A STRATEGY FOR THE TERMINATION OF USE OF THE EXISTING CITY HALL FACILITY AND DIRECT STAFF AS NECESSARY. >> THANK YOU MAYOR AND COUNCIL. THIS ITEM IS ON THE AGENDA, [00:25:02] BECAUSE AS OF NOVEMBER 17, STAFF SHOULD BE EMPLOYED ACROSS THE STREET AT THE NEW CITY HALL. THAT IS GOING TO LEAVE THIS SEVERAL THOUSAND SQUARE FEET VACANT , AND REALLY THE QUESTION BEFORE YOU IS, NUMBER ONE, WHAT DO WE SEE HAPPENING TO THIS BUILDING. NUMBER TWO, WHAT ABOUT THE CONTENTS OF THIS BUILDING. IT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT A COMMUNITY CENTER , TALKED ABOUT BEING DEMOED, BEEN TALKED ABOUT AS A BUSINESS INCUBATOR. THIS IS AND IS DISCUSSION AND DIRECTION TO STAFF TO PREPARE THE NEXT STAGE FOR THE CITY OF MIDLOTHIAN . >> TO WE HAVE ANYBODY SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS CASE? COUNSEL, QUESTIONS, IDEAS MY THOUGHTS? >> IF YOU ARE GETTING EVERYONE'S OPINION ON IT -- WE CAN PUT IN MORE PARKING. >> I THINK IT SHOULD BE DEMOLISHED AND USED IT TO THE TAXPAYERS ADVANTAGE BY CREATING PARKING SPACES FOR THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESSES, WITH MORE PARKING TO GENERATE MORE TAXES FOR CITIZENS. >> WHAT IS THE ANNUAL MAINTENANCE COST OF KEEPING THIS BUILDING? >> >> THE ANNUAL MAINTENANCE COST OF THIS CURRENT BUILDING , 50,000? >> OF THE 30,000? THE TILE, I MEAN, WE ARE SEEING THINGS THROUGHOUT THE CITY HALL -- >> >> I AGREE. I THINK THAT THE BUILDING HAS HAD A LONG AND STORIED LIFE, BUT I WORRY THAT KEEPING IT STANDING IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO EVENTUALLY INCREASE THE COST OF OWNERSHIP FOR A BUILDING THAT'S NOT GOING TO BE SUITED TO ANY OTHER PURPOSE -- PARKING STRUCTURE. >> THIS IS A PRELUDE TO THE NEXT AGENDA ITEM -- >> MY THOUGHTS WERE SIMILAR AND IN ALIGNMENT. I THINK YOU GET OPPORTUNITIES TO GRAB GREEN SPACE IN DOWNTOWN SECTORS AND PARKING. SO I WOULD ADVOCATE FOR THAT AS WELL. >> ANY COMMENTS BEFORE WE CALL VOTE. >> YES WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PARKING -- OH, IT IS JUST DIRECTION. YEAH, YEAH, THE SECOND QUESTION ARE THE CONTENTS OF THIS. THE BUILDING. THERE ARE SOME THINGS COME YOU KNOW, WE WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH AN INVENTORY OF THE SPECIAL ITEMS OF THE CITY OF MIDLOTHIAN. THE SEAL IS ONE OF THEM. THE CLOCK HAS BEEN TALKED ABOUT. SOME OF THE STUFF OUT ON THE WALLS. ONE THING THAT WE THOUGHT ABOUT STAFF IS JUST DOING A LIVE AUCTION. THAT IS SIMILAR TO JUST SOMEBODY GOING INTO A ROOM AND SAYING HOW MUCH DOES SOMEBODY WANT FOR THE CONTENTS OF THIS ROOM , AND THEN THEY HAVE 24, 48, 72 HOURS TO GET ALL THE CONTENTS OUT, AND THAT IS LESS ALL THE ARTIFACTS ARE ANYTHING THAT I TALKED ABOUT EARLIER. THAT IS KIND OF SOMETHING THAT ONE FELL SWOOP, GET THIS TAKEN CARE OF, HAVE A FINITE AMOUNT OF TIME ON GETTING THE CONTENTS OF THIS OUT, AND THEN, DEMOED THE BUILDING. >> I'M OKAY WITH THAT. >> THAT'S FINE WITH ME. >> I DON'T WANT US TO BE WASTEFUL. >> THE ONLY THING THAT I WOULD ENCOURAGE US TO THINK ABOUT, AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE GOING DOWN THE TRAIL HERE, ARE ANY OF OUR NONPROFITS ABLE TO USE ANY PORTIONS OF WHAT WE HAVE LEFT IN HERE, AND DO WE WANT TO SAY THERE IS A PERCENT TO ALL OF THAT AND THEN -- >> NONPROFITS -- >> THERE MAY BE SOME WAYS , I WILL LOOK INTO IT. THERE MAY BE SOME WAYS SOME COUNCILS -- THE CANCEL CAN GIVE THAT. INSTEAD OF SENDING IT TO AN AUCTION -- >> MAYBE WE HAVE A PRESALE WHERE WE ALLOW SOME OF THE NONPROFITS TO COME IN. >> THERE IS WAYS TO DISPOSE OF ASSETS. WE CAN BRING THAT LIST. >> HISTORICAL NATURE, ARE BEAUTIFUL MARES ON THE BACK ONLY TO BE PRESERVED. >> THERE WILL PROBABLY BE A REQUEST FOR A HISTORICAL MUSEUM BEHIND US MAYBE IS A PERFECT [00:30:03] RESTING PLACE. ARE NOT RESTING PLACE. A PERFECT PLACE FOR THOSE WONDERFUL PICTURES. >> SO NO ACTION IS REQUIRED HERE? >> THANK YOU. [EXECUTIVE SESSION] >> DO YOU HAVE CLEAR DIRECTION? >> COUNSEL , WE ARE GOING TO GO TO EXECUTIVE DISCUSSION BEFORE WE HEAR ITEM NUMBER 186, GIVEN THAT THEY MAY BE CONNECTED. SO ACCORDING TO SECTION 551.072 , CANCEL WILL CONVENE INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION PURSUANT TO THE FOLLOWING SECTIONS OF THE TEXAS GOVERNMENT CODE. EXECUTIVE SESSION ITEMS ARE DISCUSSED IN CLOSED SESSION AT ANY AND ALL ACTION IS TAKEN TO REGULAR OPEN SESSION. WE WILL BE HEARING SECTION 55 POINT -- 551 POINT 072, REAL ESTATE >>> ARIGHT IT IS 6:44 P.M. AND WE ARE BACK FROM EXECUTIVE [2024-186] SESSION. THERE IS NO ACTION TO BE TAKEN ON THE ITEM THAT WAS LISTED, SO WE WILL MOVE BACK TO THE REGULAR AGENDA, OPENING ITEM 2024-186, CONSIDER AND ACT UPON AUTHORIZING THE CITY MANAGER TO ENTER INTO A PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT WITH PARKHILL IN THE AMOUNT OF $418,250 FOR DESIGN AND ENGINEERING COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THE HERITAGE PARK EXPANSION AND DOWNTOWN DESIGN IMPROVEMENTS. >> GOOD EVENING , MAYOR AND COUNCIL. I HAVE BEEN BEFORE YOU WITH THIS ITEM IN THE PAST, AND NOW IT SEEMS LIKE WE ARE MOVING IN A LITTLE MORE, IN THE DIRECTION WE NEED TO KNOW WITH CLYDE PRESENTING ABOUT WHAT TO DO WITH THE BUILDING, SO THAT OPENS UP SOME INFORMATION ON THE PARK. SO, WE'VE GOT, I JUST WANT TO SHOW YOU THE, THE CONTRACT WOULD BE TO DESIGN AND DO A MASTER PLAN, THE FULL MASTER PLAN CONCEPT OF THE ENTIRE DOWNTOWN AREA. SO YOU SEE THE NEW CITY HALL AND HERITAGE PARK RIGHT HERE, BACK ALLEY PLAZA JUST TO GIVE YOU SOME REFERENCES. SO THE THOUGHT IS THAT WE WOULD COME IN TO CREATE A COHESIVE LOOK ON, YOU KNOW, LIGHT FIXTURES, ANY TYPE OF AMENITY THROUGHOUT DOWNTOWN , KIND OF WORKING WITH THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE THERE AND WHAT IS GOING ON JUST TO REALLY TIE THAT ALTOGETHER. I KNOW WHEN WE GET IN HERE, AND SO, AND THIS BUILDING IS REMOVED, IT WILL BE EXPANDING THE PARK TO WHATEVER THE DECISION IS BY COUNSEL TO WHAT, YOU KNOW , LEVEL WE WANT TO GO TO, AND THEN ADDING THE PARKING IN HERE. AS I WAS SAYING, THE MASTER PLAN IS FOR LOOKING AT THE CONCEPT MASTER PLAN OF THE ENTIRE AREA, AND THEN THE CONTRACT INCLUDES THE ENGINEERING OF THE ACTUAL HERITAGE PARK MSO THAT WOULD BE ENGINEERING, THE REDESIGN OF THE PARK, AND THEN THE EXPANSION AND PROVIDING THE CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS AND ALL OF THE MATERIAL TO ACTUALLY BUILD THE NEW PARK. IT IS NOT ACTUALLY ENGINEERING ALL THE REST OF THIS, BUT IT IS TAKING ALL OF THIS INTO CONSIDERATION AS WE DESIGN THAT PARK. SO , WE DO NOT COME IN AND DESIGN SOMETHING AND THEN KIND OF HAVE TO GO, STEP BACK AND LET'S TAKE ANOTHER LOOK AT IT AND HOW WE WANT TO TRY TO MAKE IT FIT NOW . SO I WOULD BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU ALL HAVE ABOUT THAT PROCESS. >> ANYONE WANTING TO SPEAK ON THIS CASE? >> >> DO WANT TO COME FORWARD, AND FOR THE RECORD STATE YOUR NAME AND WHETHER OR NOT YOU ARE IN THE CITY LIMITS. YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. >> GOOD EVENING EVERYONE. LISA HEALY. I LIVE WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS, AND I KNOW THAT WE DID APPROVE A $5 MILLION BOND. AND THIS WAS ONE OF THE MANY ITEMS LISTED THAT WE COULD POSSIBLY USE THAT MONEY FOR. HOWEVER , HERE IS A NOVEL CONCEPT. HOW ABOUT WE DON'T SPEND ALMOST HALF $1 MILLION ON A PARK ? THAT IS OUR TAX MONEY , AND I THINK THERE ARE MORE IMPORTANT THINGS TO SPEND OUR MONEY ON. LET'S FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH IT IS TO KNOCK THE BUILDING DOWN AND PUT A PARKING LOT IN. I THINK ALMOST HALF $1 MILLION TO DO THAT IS A LOT OF MONEY , AND I JUST WANT US TO BE REALLY THOUGHTFUL WHEN WE ARE SPENDING THE TAXPAYERS MONEY. AND I DON'T KNOW IF WORRYING ABOUT LIGHTS IN OTHER PARTS OF [00:35:04] DOWNTOWN, WHICH PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE DOWNTOWN COMPREHENSIVE PLAN , JUST A THOUGHT. I MEAN, WE DID DO A WHOLE NEW LOGO SO THAT WE WOULD HAVE STREET SIGNS THAT LOOKS GOOD IN THAT PLAN. LIKE, I MEAN , WE ARE JUST SPENDING MONEY LIKE WE ARE DRUNKEN SAILORS. LET'S REEL IT IN. THERE IS NO REASON FOR IT. THERE MIGHT BE A BETTER PROJECT IN THAT LIST. IT WAS A LONG LIST. ALSO , ONE FINAL THING . THE LAST TIME YOU TALKED ABOUT THIS PROJECT WAS BACK AT THE END OF JANUARY , AND YOU TABLED IT WITH NO FURTHER DISCUSSION , SO HOW ABOUT WE HAVE SOME REAL, SOLID PRESENTATION ABOUT WHAT THAT $418,000 WILL COVER , AND MAYBE YOU CAN TRIM THAT AND CUT THAT IN HALF TO CAPTURE TAKING DOWN THE BUILDING AND PUTTING UP A PARKING LOT. THANK YOU . >> THANK YOU. ANYBODY ELSE SIGN UP TO SPEAK? HEATHER , DO YOU WANT TO COME BACK UP? HEATHER , I AM ASSUMING THAT THIS PROCESS WILL INCLUDE ALL MEETINGS WITH COUNSEL , LIKELY THE PARKS AND REC BOARD, LIKELY SURVEYS GOING INTO THE COMMUNITY , ET CETERA, ET CETERA, IN ORDER TO DESIGN WHAT THE COMMUNITY'S WILL IS FOR THIS PARK . >> YES. IT WILL INCLUDE SEVERAL WORKSHOPS AND INCLUDE PUBLIC MEETINGS TO HAVE THE COMMUNITY COME IN, PROVIDE THEIR INPUT , AND WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN THE AREA WITH THE PARK AND THE PARKING LOT. AND THEN GO THROUGH THAT, AND THEN THEY WILL DESIGN TWO CONCEPT MASTER PLANS , 2 TO 3, AND THEN AFTER EVERYONE HAS THEIR INPUT, THEN THEY WILL TAKE THE ONE APPROVED BY COUNSEL AND TAKE THAT FORWARD TO DO THE ENGINEERING. >> JUST SO I AM REALLY CLEAR, THIS IS MY LAST QUESTION, THE BACK ALLEY PLAZA IS INCLUDED IN THIS -- >> IT IS NOT IN THIS FIRST PHASE. IT WAS ON THE OTHER ONE, BUT WE CAME BACK AFTER THE COUNCIL COMMENTS TO MAKE SURE WE INCLUDED THE DOWNTOWN AREA IN THE FULL CONCEPT, SO BACK ALLEY PLAZA IS NOT INCLUDED IN THIS FIRST ENGINEERING PORTION. >> I AM A LITTLE CONFUSED ON THE EXPANSION WITH THE RED SQUARE. LIKE, I THOUGHT ALL ALONG THAT THIS PROCESS WAS IDENTIFYING HERITAGE PARK, BACK ALLEY PLAZA -- >> RIGHT. SO, THE PLAN HAS BEEN IN THE LAST PLAN THE DISCUSSION WAS WORKING ON THESE TWO AREAS AND THIS LITTLE BIT OF THE TRIANGLE, BUT THIS ONE WE CAME BACK WITH BECAUSE OF DISCUSSION ABOUT WANTING TO MAKE SURE WE HAD ALL OF DOWNTOWN UTILIZING THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN AS PART OF THE IDENTIFIER OF WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE. IT IS TAKING ALL OF THAT AND PUTTING THAT IN TOGETHER TO DO THE COHESIVE DESIGN AND FOCUS ON THE PARK AND WHERE THE BUILDING IS, AND THEN THAT WOULD BE PHASE ONE. THEN WHEN WE ARE READY TO MOVE TO PHASE TWO , WE CAN IDENTIFY WHAT AREAS YOU ALL WOULD LIKE US TO WORK TOWARDS THEN. >> I JUST FEEL STRONGLY THAT WHEN THIS BUILDING IS LEVELED, IT IS GOING TO CREATE A DIRECT CONNECTIVITY TO BACK ALLEY PLAZA AND IS GOING TO FEEL LIKE ONE BIG FACILITY, BOTH IN PARKING AND IN PARK. WHATEVER THAT -- >> SO, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO IDENTIFY DIFFERENT IN THIS SQUARE THAT THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN DID NOT IDENTIFY? >> IS GOING TO GO THROUGH IT ACTUALLY LOOKED AT THAT AND ACTUALLY PUT SOMETHING ON PAPER AND CALLS IT OUT AND PUTS IT INTO THE PUBLIC COMMENTS AND WITH YOU WILL TO DECIDE EXACTLY WHAT THAT SHOULD LOOK LIKE AND HOW THAT WILL TIE INTO THE PARK AMENITIES AS WELL. IF THE MASTER PLAN IS TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW , WHAT IS GOING ON IN THESE AREAS IN THE NEW BUILDINGS, IT IS ALSO GOING TO SAY IS IS GOING TO IDENTIFY THAT WE NEED BENCHES OR PLANTERS , OR IF WE ARE GOING TO DO THE SAME BOLLARDS EVERYWHERE , SO IT IS JUST TRYING TO INCLUDE A COHESIVE -- AND THAT IS GOING TO BE BETWEEN THE MASTER PLAN AND YOU WHILE IN THE COMMUNITY OF WHAT YOU SAY YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE DONE. THAT IS WHAT THEY WILL DROP TO CREATE THAT GENERAL CONCEPT MASTER PLAN. [00:40:01] >> SO, AND I'M NOT TRYING TO BEAT A DEAD HORSE, I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND BETTER. FOR EXAMPLE, LET'S JUST TO TAKE, I ASKED INNOCENTLY REMEMBER THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE SIDEWALKS DOWN BOTH SIDES LINED WITH TREES AND LAMPS ALL THE WAY TO CAMPBELL. DIDN'T ALREADY IDENTIFY, LIKE, WE'RE GOING TO DO EIGHT-FOOT SIDEWALKS. SO, IF WE KNOW THAT'S ON F , WHAT IS IT DOING DIFFERENT OVER HERE? >> IT IS JUST DRAWING THAT THROUGH , THROUGHOUT. IF WE ARE CALLING OUT WHAT F IS, YOU KNOW, IT IS DRYING IT THROUGH ALL OF THIS AND IDENTIFYING WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE, I MEAN, WHAT LIGHT IS IT GOING TO USE, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO GO FOR MUSSO IT IS CALLING THAT OUT SO YOU HAVE THE SAME DESIGN, SO AS ALL OF THESE OTHER AREAS ARE BEING DEVELOPED , EACH PERSON IS NOT COMING IN AND PUTTING IN SOME OTHER DIFFERENT LIGHT STANDARD OR LIGHT FEATURE OUTSIDE THE BUILDING. >> >> I MEAN MY MY MY ONLY HESITATION IS , I REALLY AM , THIS ALL NEEDS TO BE DONE AT ONCE, AND NOT PIECEMEAL. I MEAN, AND THIS MIGHT NOT EVEN BE THE TIME OR PLACE TO TALK ABOUT IT, BUT IF, OR IF NOT WE CLOSE F, BECAUSE THAT IS ALL GOING TO HAVE TO BE ENGINEERED AND DECIDED AT THE SAME TIME, AND PEACE MAILING THAT MIGHT BE A PROBLEM, SO THAT MEANS WE HAVE TO SHRINK THE AREA TO PUT THIS ALL IN AT ONCE, YOU KNOW -- >> WE CAN ALTER THIS. IF YOU WANT IT ALTERED, WE HAVE DONE TWO DIFFERENT OPTIONS AND BROUGHT TWO OPTIONS, AND WE BROUGHT THIS ONE BACK, BECAUSE COUNSEL SAID WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THIS IS ALL DESIGNED IN WITH IT, BUT WE CAN ABSOLUTELY -- >> HAVEN'T BROKEN OUT INTO THREE PHASES HOW YOU ALL WANT TO DO IT , BUT THIS IS, THIS WOULD BE IN THE MASTER PLANNING OF THEM LOOKING AT THE ENTIRE CONCEPT, BUT IF YOU WANT IT ENGINEERED AT THE SAME TIME, WE CAN ABSOLUTELY HAVE A CONTRACT WRITTEN AND ALTER THIS TO THE COUNCIL'S DESIRE OF WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE FIRST. WE CAN ABSOLUTELY HAVE THEM PUT THAT TOGETHER. >> WELL I GUESS THE ONLY THING THAT WOULD MAKE ME NOT WANT TO DO THAT, AND I DON'T EXPECT YOU TO HAVE THIS ANSWER, THE BALLPARK WHAT WOULD IT COST TO DO IT ALL AT ONCE? CONSTRUCTION? BECAUSE IF YOU ARE SAYING WE CAN DO ALL THIS ONE SIDE FOR $2 MILLION, BUT THIS PARK IS GOING TO COST $5 MILLION, THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT CONVERSATION. >> THAT CONVERSATION COMES WITH THE COMMUNITY AND THE COUNCIL DECIDE TO PUT IN IT. IT DEPENDS ON WHAT AMENITIES WE PUT IN, AND HOW, WITH THE COST OF THOSE ARE. IF YOU GO IN AND SOD IT AND PUT TREES AND SOME IRRIGATION, YOU ARE DOWN HERE. IF WE GO IN AND PUT SOME WATER FEATURES AND, YOU KNOW, CHANGE THINGS UP AND ADD A BUNCH OF AMENITIES, THAT IS WHERE THOSE COSTS COME FROM. >> AND THAT WILL BE DETERMINED THROUGH THE PROCESS. >> YES, ABSOLUTELY. THAT WOULD BE THE RELEVANT PUBLIC INPUT AND ALL OF THE WORKSHOPS WITH YOU, THE PARK BOARD IMMUNO, ALL OF THOSE -- >> I DON'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF INPUT ON THE SQUARE. I DO FROM THE FRONT DOOR OF THE NEW CITY HALL BUILDING TO THE RAILROAD TRACKS IN SOUTH. LIKE , THAT IS WHERE MY HEAD IS AT. -- >> I WOULD ALMOST SAY EVEN IF YOU -- >> NO , AT&T. >> YES. IN THE OTHER PROPOSAL BECAME TO HEAR , AND IT IS BECAUSE WE HAVE THAT LITTLE SQUARE RIGHT THERE. >> OKAY. >> THE TRIANGLE. >> I SEE YOUR LIGHT ON. >> YEAH. MY THOUGHT PROCESS IS TWOFOLD. ONE, WITH THE HERITAGE PARK AREA AND TO THE CURRENT BUILDING WE ARE SITTING IN NOW, PARKING, PARKING, PARKING. IN TWO , I AM ALL FOR PARKS, BUT I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO INCREASE THE SIZE OF HERITAGE PARK AT THE EXPENSE OF PARKING THAT WOULD HELP HER DOWNTOWN BUSINESSES. >> MIKE OR ROSS , COMMENTS? >> I'M INCLINED TO AGREE IN THE SHORT TERM. I THINK WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT HERE IS SOMETHING LONG-RANGE . I THINK IF AT SOME POINT WE WERE ABLE TO GO WITH SOME KIND OF VERTICAL PARKING THAT MAKES UP FOR THE LAND THAT WE OWN AT THE TIME WOULD BE THE IDEAL TIME AT THAT POINT TO LOOK AT POTENTIALLY EXPANDING MUNICIPAL GREEN SPACE DOWNTOWN , WHICH I THINK IS IMPORTANT TO THE COMMUNITY, BUT AS YOU SAID RIGHT NOW, TODAY , THE DECISION HAS BEEN MADE TO REDUCE THE TOP [00:45:08] LAND REVENUE OF THE COMMUNITY LAST YEAR THROUGH DIFFERENT TAX EXEMPTIONS. I DON'T KNOW THAT HALF $1 MILLION JUST TO FIGURE OUT HOW WE WANT TO SPEND ANOTHER $7 MILLION IS WHERE I AM COMFORTABLE TO BE AT RIGHT NOW TODAY. WE KNOW WE WANT PARKING DOWNTOWN IN THE SHORT-TERM. I THINK THERE IS A PLACE AND TIME IN THE FUTURE WHERE WE SIT DOWN AND REALLY HAVE THIS CONVERSATION, IT MAY HAVE A DIFFERENT CRITERIA. SO TIMING -- >> UNDERSTANDING THE PLAN , IT CAN POTENTIALLY SIT ON THE SHELF LONG-TERM. AS ELEMENTS OF THE PARKS PLAN AND THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN IN THE CITY'S COMPREHENSIVE PLAN NOW, PERSONALLY I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD GET IT ON THE BOOKS. >> SO I REMEMBER WHY AND THE DOLLAR AMOUNTS THAT WE INCLUDED IN THE $5 MILLION -- THE CONVERSATIONS THAT I REMEMBER JUST HAVING WERE THAT THE -- INAUDIBLE ] -- I REMEMBER THAT THE PARK WOULD COME OVER TO THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING, AND THAT WOULD BE ABOUT IT. I REMEMBER THAT IN ORDER TO MOVE THAT PARK , TO PUT PRODUCTS INTO THAT PARK , AND EVEN SOME OF THAT MONEY POTENTIALLY BEING INVOLVED IN SOME OF THE COST TO TEAR THE BUILDING DOWN, WHICH I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAS CHANGED, WE TALKED ABOUT THE BUILDING POSSIBLY BEING TORN DOWN WITHIN OUR OWN FOLKS WITHIN THE CITY -- HALF $1 MILLION WILL BE INCORPORATED INTO THAT . THE THOUGHT PROCESS, OF COURSE, THAN THE REST OF THOSE DOLLARS GO INTO ATTAINMENT CONTENT LAND ACQUISITIONS AND I WON'T GET INTO DETAILS, BUT, SO NOW WHAT CONCERNS ME IS THIS. THAT I DON'T, I FEEL LIKE WE ARE CONTINUOUSLY DEALING WITH SMALL BOXES . I'VE SAID THIS QUITE A BIT LATELY, BUT I KNOW WE HAVE GOTTEN TO A CONVERSATION LATELY ABOUT THE HOTEL , AND HOW HOTEL DOESN'T REALLY FIT THERE, AND IS THIS HOW WE WANT THIS HOTEL LOOKING IN 40 YEARS, AND IT IS BECAUSE I DO BELIEVE WE HAVE A DOWNTOWN, OLD TOWNE OVERLAY . I DO BELIEVE WE HAVE THIS DOWNTOWN CONCEPT THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT NOW. I BELIEVE THAT I THINK WE HAVE GOT INC., DID WE GET INCORPORATED IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN THE OLD TOWN STYLE OVERLAY ONTO MAIN STREET? >> GOT IT. WE KNOW THIS IS CONNECTED, AND WE KEEP DOING THESE LITTLE PROJECTS THAT THEN WE FIND OUT WHEN WE GET A NEW COUNSEL LATER AND THERE NEVER WAS A MASTER PLAN, SO WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, WE HAVE A UNIQUE OPPORTUNITY THAT THE ENTIRE INNER LOOP IS A BLANK SLATE. IT'S JUST STANDING THERE. OUR CITY AND OUR TOWN IS GOING THROUGH CHANGES TO WHERE A LOT OF OUR FAST FOOD, ESPECIALLY A LOT OF OUR HOMES ON MAIN STREET ARE GOING TO BE -- WHAT WE WANT TO LOOK LIKE IN 20 YEARS? SO MY FEAR IS FIRST OF ALL THAT I AM ALMOST THINKING THAT YES, COULD WE EXPAND THE PARK FOR THE ROVER? PROBABLY EVENTUALLY , BUT I WILL LOOK AT THE REALITIES OF WHAT IS HIGHEST ON MY LIST . I DON'T GET COMPLAINTS ABOUT MAN , I AND GOT ENOUGH PARK SPACE DOWN IN DOWNTOWN TO PLAY CORN HOLE. I'M GETTING COMPLAINTS ABOUT I NEED PARKING. WHERE'S THE PARKING. WHERE'S THE PARKING. YOU ALL PUT THE CITY HALL DOWNTOWN. HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO PARK? WE DO HAVE PARKING GOING IN, AND I WAS GLAD TO SEE WHEN I VISITED THE CITY HALL SITE THE OTHER DAY, BESIDE THE AT& T, AND IT IS ACTUALLY BIGGER THAN I THOUGHT, BECAUSE LITERALLY, DOWN TO LITERALLY ON TOP OF THE AT&T BUILDING. THERE IS MORE ROOM THERE, BUT I AM ALSO CONCERNED THAT WHEN THE OLD LAWSON BUILDING OPENS FOR BUSINESS AND YOU HAVE ALL THOSE APARTMENTS UPSTAIRS YOU CAN KISS THAT PARKING LOT GOODBYE. IT IS GOING TO BE FULL. I REALLY DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH PARKING [00:50:02] THE CITY HALL IS -- SO IN SAYING ALL OF THIS, IT MUST FEEL AS THOUGH I DON'T KNOW, I'M HAVING A TOUGH TIME GETTING ON BOARD SPENDING HALF $1 MILLION IN A BOX THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE INCORPORATED IN A BIG PAL AND, A DETAILED PLAN, WHAT IS THIS INNER LOOP GOING TO LOOK LIKE, WHEN HIS SON IN 20 YEARS, SO THAT WE DON'T DO THIS BOX AND IN THE NEXT COUNSEL COMES ALONG AND THEY WANT TO DO SOMETHING OUTSIDE OF THAT BOX, OVER THERE ACROSS THE TRACKS, SO THEY HAVE TO REDEFINE THAT BOX, BECAUSE THEY NEVER DEFINED OUTSIDE THE BOX. THAT IS KIND OF HOW I FEEL LIKE WE ARE ALWAYS GOING HERE LATELY, SO I KIND OF FEEL LIKE RIGHT NOW, AND I DON'T THINK UNTIL CITY HALL IS DONE AND WE'VE MOVED IN, AND THIS GETS TORN DOWN , AND WE GET 3 TO 5 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, I KNOW RIGHT NOW WE NEED PARKING. I KNOW THAT TO ME, YEAH, WILL IT HURT TO EXPAND THE PARK A LITTLE BIT OVER 34 TWO IN FRONT OF THAT BUILDING , AND MAY BE IN 10 YEARS WE DECIDE THIS GOING TO BE A 2 TO 3 STORY PARKING GARAGE. MAYBE THE PARKING GARAGE ENDS UP OVER HERE AT THE DOLLAR STORE. I HAVE NO IDEA. I FEEL LIKE WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE A PARKING GARAGE EVENTUALLY, BUT UNTIL WE CAN GET ADDITIONAL PARKING SOMEWHERE, I CAN'T FATHOM EXPANDING THE PARK AS MUCH AS I WOULD LIKE TO. I DEFINITELY WOULD MINIMALLY GO ALONG WITH IT IF WE ARE GOING TO PLAN THIS, THIS NEEDS TO BE INCORPORATED INTO THAT, BUT I AM ALSO VERY FEARFUL THAT THIS BOX IS ABOUT 1/50 OF WHAT I HAVE . THAT IS WHERE I'M CONCERNED. AND FOR ME TO SPEND HALF $1 MILLION ON AN LITTLE BOX THAT I DON'T THINK IS GOING TO MATCH THE OUTER BOX WHEN ANOTHER COUNSEL IS COMING ALONG, -- >> YOU JUST HAVE TO TAKE STEPS TO GET THERE. >> AND ALL THE, WELL, WE HAVE A MASTER PLAN, PARKS MASTER PLAN NOW THAT WILL ADDRESS A LOT OF THE DEVELOPMENT. I THINK THE ONLY REASON THIS IS A DIFFERENT BOX IS IT IS NOT ALL OF CITY. THIS IS A HISTORICAL DISTRICT. IT IS ITS OWN DISTRICT. MAYBE IS NOT THE ROUTE TO GO. I WILL TELL YOU, WE ARE ALL TALKING ABOUT PARKING. I AM PRETTY INTIMATELY FAMILIAR WITH THE DOWNTOWN PARKING PROBLEM, AND I WILL TELL YOU, IT IS ACTUALLY NOT WHEN YOU ALL ARE THINKING. THE PROBLEM WITH DOWNTOWN IS THE AMOUNT OF CONSTRUCTION THAT IS TAKING ALL OF THE PARKING. AND IF WE DON'T, WHATEVER WE ARE GOING TO DO, YOU KNOW , WE COULD FIGHT THAT FIGHT RIGHT NOW, BUT WHATEVER WE DO, IF WE DON'T HURRY IT UP AND FINISH AND GET ON WITH CONSTRUCTION DOWNTOWN, WE ARE HURTING ALL OF THE BUSINESSES, BECAUSE, I MEAN, BETWEEN LAWSON AND THEIR PROJECT IN CITY HALL, THE LONGER WE CONTINUE CONSTRUCTION , THE LONGER IT IS FOR PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO HAVE PARKING AVAILABILITY, THE MORE IT HURTS THE BUSINESSES. >> ONLY ONE QUICK COMMENT -- INAUDIBLE ] >> AND LAWSON. THEY ARE TAKING UP ALL OF THE LOTS. >> >> THE CRITERIA WE HAVE NOW , AND IN THREE YEARS ALL OF THAT HAS CHANGED BECAUSE OF THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE COMING ONLINE, THE DEVELOPMENT AND CONSTRUCTION THAT IS COMING NOW, AND WE HAVE 200,000, 215,000 OF THE CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS, THEY GO RIGHT OUT THE WINDOW AND THE CONCEPT CHANGES. I DON'T THINK WE ARE READY TODAY TO ESTABLISH A CONCEPT BECAUSE THERE ARE TOO MANY VARIABLES -- >> I KNOW GOING BACK TO THE COMPLAINT WE HAVE BEFORE US WE HAVE A HALF-EMPTY DOWNTOWN IS NOT DOING ANYTHING. I MEAN, I [00:55:01] REALLY THINK , WE CAN SHRINK THE SIZE, AND WE ARE ALL MAKING THE ASSUMPTION THIS IS GOING TO BE GRASS. I DON'T THINK ANYONE SAID THAT. I THINK THE PARKING STAYS. WE TALKED ABOUT IS THIS GREEN SPACE AROUND THE FIRE STATION BEING INCLUDED, AND MAYBE, I DON'T KNOW , I DON'T KNOW. I FEEL LIKE YOU ALL ARE MAKING A LOT OF ASSUMPTIONS , AND IT'S NOT BEEN SAID. I THINK WE, I WOULD ASSUME WE WOULD LEAVE PARKING HEREIN EXPANDED HERE. WE WOULD BE INCREASING THE AMOUNT OF PARKING. WE ARE CURRENTLY INCREASING IN OVER 100 SPOTS COMPARATIVELY TO WHAT WE HAD BEFORE. NOT INCLUDING THIS. >> AND THE THOUGHT WAS JUST EXPANDING THE PARK, I MEAN, THAT WAS A DECISION THAT YOU ALL MAKE DURING THE PROCESS, BUT IT WAS EXPANDING THE PARK HERE AND THE REST OF THIS COMING PARKING, AND THAT IT WOULD UTILIZE THE PARKS MASTER PLAN AND THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN COMBINED WITH CITIZEN -- >> WHERE WE WERE GOING TO PUT IN A PARKING GARAGE -- INAUDIBLE ] >> RIGHT. >> IT SOUNDS TO ME LIKE THIS NEEDS FURTHER DISCUSSION. ANYBODY AMENABLE TO TABLING THIS TO A LATER DATE? >> BAD FOR HEATHER, BECAUSE IF THIS THING GETS TOWARD TOWN AND WE ARE GOING WELL WE ARE DISCUSSING IT, SHE NEEDS TO AT LEAST KNOW WELL, I'M GOING TO SOMEHOW BRING THE PARK OVER TO HERE -- >> BUT THAT WOULD BE REVEALED IN THE PLAN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. >> THIS DOESN'T A SITE THAT. THIS DECIDES TO WE APPROVE GETTING THE PLAN PUT TOGETHER, WHICH WOULD BE DISCOVERED THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS. >> BUT IT ALSO ENGINEERS THE PLAN RELATIVE TO THE HERITAGE PARK AND CITY HALL SITE ONLY . SO THE CONCEPT PLANNING THE BOLD LINE , I'M COLORBLIND, I HAVE NO IDEA, THE TRAPEZOIDAL SHAPE THAT ENCOMPASSES, LIKE , 12 BLOCKS , AND WE ARE ENGINEERING HERITAGE PARK AND WHERE WE ARE SITTING RIGHT NOW BASED UPON WHAT THE PLAN REVEALS AS THE HIGHEST AND BEST USE OF THOSE TWO TRACKS RELATIVE TO THE TRACKS WE OWN. >> WE CAN SHRINK THE TRAPEZOID. MY WHOLE FOCUS IS TRYING TO GET THIS WHOLE PIECE FIGURED OUT , FROM THE FRONT DOOR CITY HALL TO THE TRAIN TRACKS. >> I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THAT BEFORE I STEP AWAY FROM HERE, WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE , WHATEVER YOU DECIDE YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE THIS BACK, IS THIS SECTION RIGHT HERE . >> FOR ME THE QUESTION BOILS DOWN TO, IF RIGHT NOW TODAY WE ARE SAYING WE DON'T KNOW REALLY WHAT -- INTERVENING USE, WOULD IT BE SURFACE OF A PARKING, WHAT IS THE COST TO HAVE SOMEBODY LEAVE THE PARK AS IS AND JUST ENGINEER A PARKING LOT ? I MEAN, IT IS DRAINAGE AT THAT POINT, RIGHT? ARE ENGINEERING COST IS GOING TO STRAIGHTEN DRASTICALLY FROM 260,000+ HOURLY RATE , AND THE CONCEPT PLAN GOES AWAY AT $170,000. THEN WE CAN ACTUALLY INVEST DOLLARS TODAY INTO A CAPITAL PROJECT OF PAVING THIS FOR USABLE PARKING WHILE WE WAIT FOR A BETTER TIME TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE OVERALL PLAN IS , BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO INCORPORATE THIS INTO A WIDER SCOPE. >> >> I SEE THIS WHOLE BUILDING DOWN HERE ALL THE WAY OVER TO THERE, ALL THE WAY UP TO THERE, ALL THE WAY OVER THERE, ON THE WEB TO THEIR THE RAILROAD TRACKS, AND ALL THE WAY BACK -- THEY ARE JUST FOCUSING RIGHT IN HERE, AND THERE IS SOME BIG STUFF -- >> I GUESS I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IN THOSE AREAS AREN'T CALLED OUT IN THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN . I MEAN, BECAUSE THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN SPECIFICALLY CALLS THESE THINGS OUT. ALL WE ARE DOING IS TRYING TO DESIGN A PARK. CALLED OUT ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS AND SEEING STREET -- I LIKE STANDARDS -- >> WE ARE JUST DESIGNING THE PARK. THE $170,000 -- >> AUTHORITY SAID YOU CAN SHRINK THAT DOWN. WHATEVER THIS IS, LIKE, I'M JUST FOCUSED RIGHT HERE. >> I WOULD BE MORE AGREEABLE -- >> AND THAT SAVES ABOUT 132,000. IF YOU LOOK AT, IF YOU LOOK AT THE TASKS NUMBER TWO , IT GIVES A CREDIT BACK FOR THE CONCEPT PLAN , SEE WE NEED TO ADD THAT BACK -- -- INSTEAD OF SAVING 170 YOU SAVE ABOUT 132. >> I HEAR WHAT YOU AND MIKE ARE SAYING. IF WE NEED PARKING OR DON'T NEED PARKING, BUT I FEEL LIKE THAT IS WHAT THE WHOLE [01:00:02] POINT OF DOING A CONCEPT IS FOR, TO GET FEEDBACK ON WHAT IS OR IS NOT NEEDED SO WE CAN PLAN FOR IT. TO ME, I THINK TO YOUR POINT, A PARKING STRUCTURE WHILE WE'RE THERE LOOKING, FIGURE HOW MUCH SPACE A PARKING STRUCTURE WOULD NEED, DESIGN THE PARK AROUND, AND IF THERE WAS A PARKING STRUCTURE WHERE THIS PARKING LOT IS -- OR A PARKING LOT, THEN WHERE WOULD WE PUT THE PARKING STRUCTURE. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE CONCEPT PLAN. I THOUGHT THAT WAS WHAT WE WERE SHOOTING FOR. SO -- I JUST WANT TO VOTE. IF IT'S ME, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SHRINK IT DOWN AND FOCUS ON AREAS FROM BACK ALLEY IN THE REAL ESTATE AROUND IT AND MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT. >> OKAY. >> >> IS THERE FURTHER DISCUSSION BEFORE WE TAKE A MOTION. B MCNEELY OF THE QUESTION THAT I HAVE IS THE WAY THIS IS WRITTEN IS THAT IF WE , IS WE WOULD DO THE CONCEPT PLAN, ARE WE THEN REQUIRED TO DO THE ENGINEERING? >> NO . >> FOR, FOR THE PARK IN THE CITY HALL. IS THIS REALLY A MULTIPART BID WOULD WE COULD JUST SAY CONCEPT PLAN, AND THEN STOP , SPEND THE $32,000 AND STOP. >> I GUESS WE WOULD NEED, IF THAT IS WHAT COUNSEL WANTS TO DO, WE WOULD PROBABLY NEED TO GO BACK AND GET A NUMBER AND BRING A THAT. WE ARE JUST GOING TO CONCEPT THE PARK, AND ONCE THAT IS DONE, THEN WE WOULD HAVE TO BRING IT BACK ANOTHER ONE TO ACTUALLY ENGINEER -- >> DEPENDING ON WHAT THE CONCEPT IS. IF IT IS A PARKING STRUCTURE, WELL THAT IS GOING TO BE SIGNIFICANTLY MORE EXPENSIVE TO ENGINEER AND ULTIMATELY BUILD, SO WE CAN USE THE CONCEPT TO SAY HEY , WE ARE GOING TO RESERVE THIS MUCH LAND AND LET THE PARK TO THE REST OF IT AND WE WILL PUT A SURFACE PARKING LOT NOW UNTIL WE ARE READY AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE TO GO VERTICAL. I LIKE THAT MUCH BETTER THAN EARMARKING $420,000 TODAY SIGHT UNSEEN FOR A CONCEPT THAT HAS YET TO BE APPROVED, BUT WE ARE GOING TO ALREADY HIT, BE ON THE HOOK TO PAY FOR THE ENGINEERING FOR IT. >> WE JUST HAVE IT WRITTEN HOW YOU ALL WANT TO SEE IT AND MOVE FORWARD. >> OKAY. OKAY, SO DO WE, DO WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO MAKE THAT MOTION TONIGHT, OR SHOULD WE TABLE AND DISCUSS FURTHER? >> CAN YOU JUST GIVE US DIRECTION? CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG , BUT GOING BACK TO, I THINK YOU SAID IF YOU ALL WANT TO SEE A CONCEPT PLAN FOR JUST WHERE WE'RE SITTING TODAY, I'M GOING TO SAY WE ARE SITTING BACK ALLEY PLAZA, YEAH, HERITAGE PARK, THIS TRIANGLE, WE JUST WANT TO GET A CONCEPT BILLED FOR THAT AREA , SO WE NEED TO BRING BACK A PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT FOR JUST THAT. ONCE WE ARE DONE WITH THAT BUT WE WILL BRING IT BACK AND OTHER PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT FOR ENGINEERING. THAT IS IF WE CHOOSE TO DO IT AT THAT TIME. >> I WOULD BE SUPPORTIVE OF THAT IDEA. >> ARE WE GOING TO HAVE ANY TYPE OF WORKSHOP TO DECIDE , HOW ARE THEY GOING TO GO AND DEVELOP A PLAN? WHERE IS THE PARK GOING TO END? >> THEY ARE GOING TO MEET WITH US. THEY WILL MEET WITH YOU ALL, THE WORKSHOP , AND HE WILL HAVE ALL OF THE PUBLIC MEETINGS, AND SO THEY WILL TAKE YOUR DIRECTION AND WORK THROUGH THAT FOR THE CONCEPT PLAN. >> OKAY. SO YOU ARE ASKING FOR DIRECTION, NO ACTION ? >> I THINK IF YOU GIVE US DIRECTION, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO BRING BACK, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO BRING BACK A PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT WITH THE NEW AMOUNT. >> ITEM? OKAY, I MAKE THE MOTION TO TABLE THIS AGENDA ITEM INDEFINITELY SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER WEAVER. PLEASE VOTE. ITEM PASSES 5-0. THANK YOU, HEATHER. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.